{"id":14985,"date":"2013-07-13T09:00:30","date_gmt":"2013-07-13T13:00:30","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/pmedicine.org\/epatients\/?p=14985"},"modified":"2013-07-13T09:21:48","modified_gmt":"2013-07-13T13:21:48","slug":"crowd-trumps-credentials-medpedias-dead","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/2013\/07\/crowd-trumps-credentials-medpedias-dead.html","title":{"rendered":"Crowd trumps credentials: Medpedia&#8217;s dead."},"content":{"rendered":"<p><a href=\"https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/3\/2013\/07\/37067-hi-Medpedia-Logo-rotated.png\" data-rel=\"lightbox-image-0\" data-rl_title=\"\" data-rl_caption=\"\" title=\"\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\" wp-image-14992 alignleft\" alt=\"Medpedia logo tipped over\" src=\"https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/3\/2013\/07\/37067-hi-Medpedia-Logo-rotated-300x265.png\" width=\"300\" height=\"265\" srcset=\"https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/3\/2013\/07\/37067-hi-Medpedia-Logo-rotated-300x265.png 300w, https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/3\/2013\/07\/37067-hi-Medpedia-Logo-rotated-800x708.png 800w, https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/3\/2013\/07\/37067-hi-Medpedia-Logo-rotated.png 960w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 300px) 100vw, 300px\" \/><\/a>In medicine, to achieve the best you need the best information. So an essential question is, who gets to <em>say<\/em> what&#8217;s best?<\/p>\n<p>That question took a sharp turn this week with the news that Medpedia is dead.<\/p>\n<p>Medical librarian Laika Spoetnik has a strong post on the demise, including an interview with its founder, James Currier:\u00a0<a title=\"Read Medpedia, the Medical Wikipedia, is Dead. And we Missed its\u00a0Funeral\u2026\" href=\"http:\/\/laikaspoetnik.wordpress.com\/2013\/07\/12\/medpedia-the-medical-wikipedia-is-dead-and-we-missed-its-funeral\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"bookmark\">Medpedia, the Medical Wikipedia, is Dead. And we Missed its\u00a0Funeral<\/a>.\u00a0 The bottom line is:<\/p>\n<h2>The crowd trumps credentials.<\/h2>\n<p>It&#8217;s another nail in the coffin of the outdated idea that authority with massive credentials &#8211; and investor money &#8211; will give you better information than a mob with no investors, governed only by community rules.\u00a0Read Laika&#8217;s post for several analyses back then; here&#8217;s the short version of the concept as I saw it:<br \/>\n<!--more--><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>In 2007 &#8220;Doc Tom&#8221; Ferguson&#8217;s white paper (see the right column of this site) documented how information in patient communities sometimes goes well beyond what their clinicians have seen.\n<ul>\n<li>In my own 2007 kidney cancer case, <i>all <\/i>the treatment information on established medical websites was out of date, but my patient community had the latest. What&#8217;s up with that??<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li>So Medpedia seemed like a <i>great <\/i>idea: a medical Wikipedia, where patients and clinicians could collaborate on keeping things up to date.<\/li>\n<li>But, as I posted then in <a href=\"https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/archives\/2008\/07\/medpedia-where-are-the-patients.html\" target=\"_blank\">Medpedia: where are the patients<\/a>:<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<blockquote>\n<p style=\"padding-left: 30px;\">&#8230; when I saw their home page it literally took my breath away: there are invitations for doctors to join, and organizations to contribute content, but\u00a0<b>nothing for patients \u2013 we can contribute ideas, not content.<\/b><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>A crowdsourced medical encyclopedia was fine in concept, but its implementation was unaware that reality has changed. (Ferguson saw it; their investors didn&#8217;t.) So among other things, Wikipedia &#8211; an uncredentialed, leaderless crowd &#8211; has often outperformed Medpedia, whose reliance on credentials was its entire\u00a0<i>raison d&#8217;\u00eatre<\/i>: if the premise fails, the enterprise flops. So it goes.<\/p>\n<p>The problem was predicted by our Feb 2009 post\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/archives\/2009\/02\/medpedia-who-gets-to-say-what-info-is-reliable.html\" target=\"_blank\">Who gets to say what info is reliable?<\/a>\u00a0which drew 70 comments. The post asked, &#8220;Who will vet the vetters?&#8221; Comments included this, from SPM founder John Grohol:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>&#8230; If you start with a closed, walled-off garden to begin with in terms of contributors, you\u2019re already starting at a disadvantage.<\/p>\n<p>Wikipedia showed that shared knowledge can work &#8230; but it takes the devotion of thousands of dedicated, altruistic people. Medpedia, although perhaps well-intentioned, is coming at health and medical knowledge from a distinctly 1.0 \u201cdocs know best\u201d philosophy.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s fascinating to see that old-school philosophy be grafted on to a 2.0 tool and business model, in hopes of generating something new and different. I have my doubts, reading through the tripe listed currently for mental disorders (full of misinformation).<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Laika&#8217;s post links to numerous comments by sharp observers, including internet mega-maven <a href=\"http:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Clay_Shirky\" target=\"_blank\">Clay Shirky<\/a>, and ScienceRoll doc @berci, <a href=\"http:\/\/scienceroll.com\/2009\/02\/20\/launching-medpedia-from-the-perspective-of-a-wikipedia-administrator\/\" target=\"_blank\">who said back<\/a> then:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><strong>I believe elitism kills content.<\/strong>\u00a0Only the power of masses controlled by well-designed editing guidelines can lead to a comprehensive encyclopaedia.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>The very first medical conference I ever attended was Connected Health, October 2008, where Shirky said in a keynote:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>The patients on ACOR don&#8217;t need our help, and they don&#8217;t need our permission.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n<p>Here&#8217;s to the visionaries &#8211; the people who understand what&#8217;s going on, below the surface, and can see the future, so we can build on it.<\/p>\n<p>I encourage you to <a href=\"http:\/\/laikaspoetnik.wordpress.com\/2013\/07\/12\/medpedia-the-medical-wikipedia-is-dead-and-we-missed-its-funeral\/\" target=\"_blank\">read Laika&#8217;s post<\/a>, including all the links. She&#8217;s\u00a0<a href=\"http:\/\/twitter.com\/LaikaS\" target=\"_blank\">@LaikaS<\/a>\u00a0on Twitter.<\/p>\n<p>&nbsp;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>In medicine, to achieve the best you need the best information. So an essential question is, who gets to say what&#8217;s best? That question took a sharp turn this week with the news that Medpedia is dead. Medical librarian Laika Spoetnik has a strong post on the demise, including an interview with its founder, James [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":4,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_et_pb_use_builder":"","_et_pb_old_content":"","_et_gb_content_width":"","jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":false,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[21],"tags":[72,6830,1274,6806,3433,6412,6841,6822,6838,856,6842,2420,6831,6827,6826,5289,1260,540,6843,6836,857,1413,6834,50],"coauthors":[],"class_list":["post-14985","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-e-ptsresources","tag-blog","tag-cancer-case","tag-clinicians","tag-credentials","tag-crowd","tag-demise","tag-investor-money","tag-invitations","tag-james-currier","tag-kidney-cancer","tag-medical-encyclopedia","tag-medical-librarian","tag-medical-websites","tag-mob","tag-nail-in-the-coffin","tag-observers","tag-patient-communities","tag-patient-community","tag-premise","tag-sharp-turn","tag-tom-ferguson","tag-trumps","tag-vetters","tag-wikipedia"],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v23.9 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>Crowd trumps credentials: Medpedia&#039;s dead. - SPM Blog<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/participatorymedicine.org\/epatients\/2013\/07\/crowd-trumps-credentials-medpedias-dead.html\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Crowd trumps credentials: Medpedia&#039;s dead. - SPM Blog\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"In medicine, to achieve the best you need the best information. 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